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22315 |
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Date: June 09, 2020 at 17:07:34
From: georg, [DNS_Address]
Subject: discuss the Bible means just that, talking about the Bible (NT) |
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Responses:
[22322] [22323] [22325] [22328] [22330] [22331] [22332] [22357] [22333] |
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22322 |
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Date: June 10, 2020 at 10:51:38
From: chaskuchar@stcharles, [DNS_Address]
Subject: i have brought up the bible refering to the reception of the body of |
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Christ but no responses. i bring up the mother of God
but everyone thinks she was a common woman just as any
other woman. why do some think that God can not honor
His mother just as we do on earth? those are
importand subject to discuss. chas
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Responses:
[22323] [22325] [22328] [22330] [22331] [22332] [22357] [22333] |
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22323 |
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Date: June 10, 2020 at 16:23:07
From: georg, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: i have brought up the bible refering to the reception of the body... |
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perhaps the focus should be on Jesus
to preach Mary and leave out Jesus is fruitless
Jesus is our salvation and he died so that we would have the grace of God
it is the emphasis on Mary that disturbs many
it is fine to discuss Mary but not to the exclusion of Jesus
anyway that is my belief
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Responses:
[22325] [22328] [22330] [22331] [22332] [22357] [22333] |
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22325 |
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Date: June 11, 2020 at 03:16:09
From: chaskuchar@stcharles, [DNS_Address]
Subject: you didn't bring up the Bread. |
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John said we need to eat the bread daily. Jesus
taught about him becoming the bread of life.
hopefully you receive it daily. chas
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Responses:
[22328] [22330] [22331] [22332] [22357] [22333] |
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22328 |
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Date: June 11, 2020 at 10:24:16
From: georg, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: you didn't bring up the Bread. |
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but you did and you have my thanks for it
but my partaking of the Spirit is through prayer
one is to pray in his closet, or so says Jesus
one does not require a priest to access the LORD, Jehovah
the man Jesus is at the right hand of the LORD, Jehovah
we are told what it says in the Holy Bible not some idea of man
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Responses:
[22330] [22331] [22332] [22357] [22333] |
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22330 |
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Date: June 11, 2020 at 13:06:31
From: ryan, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: you didn't bring up the Bread. |
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if the priest turns right, it is prudent to turn left...
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Responses:
[22331] [22332] [22357] [22333] |
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22331 |
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Date: June 11, 2020 at 17:02:45
From: georg, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: you didn't bring up the Bread. |
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nonsense, not relevant to anything being discussed that is fathomable
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Responses:
[22332] [22357] [22333] |
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22332 |
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Date: June 12, 2020 at 05:55:18
From: chaskuchar@stcharles, [DNS_Address]
Subject: but you are limiting your thinking about God |
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God made the Holy Family to set an example for how we
should live our lives. then spiritually with the
Father, Son and Holy Ghost. Mary was the real Mother
of God, Wife of the Holy Ghost. If you leave Mary out
of the equation, you are missing part of the
wonderment of Life God created for us. chas
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Responses:
[22357] [22333] |
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22357 |
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Date: June 17, 2020 at 01:53:56
From: ryan, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: but you are limiting your thinking about God |
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THE TEACHING OF CHRIST
THE problem of esoteric teaching is to connect a higher level of understanding with a lower level. The supreme example is Jesus Christ, who was born of a human mother and yet was the Son of God. We can understand nothing about the drama of Jesus Christ unless we understand that he was in a way two things - the son of man and the son of God. This means that he was in contact with a lower level and yet in some way in contact with a higher level. Speaking in a more general way the problem of esoteric teaching, which is sown into the earth at definite intervals, is to maintain some kind of contact with a higher level of being. When contact between the upper and lower notes is lost, all that is below perishes, goes mad, and ends in violence. Christ came as a mediator between the higher and lower level. His task was, as simply a human being exposed to every temptation, to overcome everything belonging to the lower level, that is, the human level, and to unite the human level with the divine level. God came down to earth as a human being but as such was unable to use the divine. We can under- stand in our small way that otherwise his task would have been easy and we often wonder why his task was not easy, being of divine origin — that is, that he had in him the divine and as such was the Son of God. Unless we understand this we cannot realise why he was tempted up to the last moment. We argue in some such way as this: if Christ were the Son of God, why was he tempted? Why did he suffer such agonies? Why was everything so difficult for him? Why could he not simply show people his powers? Why did he not turn stones into bread? But the whole question is infinitely more strange and subtle. At the stage of history when Christ appeared, there was the greatest danger that the human race might be cut off from all communication with a higher level of understanding. The whole world was burning up into violence and materiality. All higher values were disappearing or had disappeared. There was no kind of understanding that man is a spiritual being and not merely a creature of the flesh. And in this situation someone had to establish the connection between the level of earth and
the level of Heaven. But you can see that if a man were endowed with powers of a higher level, or the level of Heaven as it is called in the Gospels, and having these powers, or rather, being able to use these powers on earth, he would not make an ex- ample of a human being raising himself up through inner battles, inner doubts and human temptations. If you read the Gospels closely, you will see that Christ had not only many temptations but many doubts and even on the cross, he said: 'My God, why hast thou forsaken me?' Now if we realise that the task of Christ was to connect the human with the divine, the Son of Man with the Son of God and for this reason he had to suffer everything that a human being must suffer in climbing the ladder of inner development, we can understand the central meaning of the Gospels much better. We can also understand why he had to overcome his mother, as is exemplified in many parables and miracles, because his mother represents his human side. By overcoming, by fulfilling his task, Christ once more established connection between the higher and the lower level, between the spiritual and the natural and for that reason he had to undergo all his sufferings and finally undergo the death of a criminal without any help being given to him. But by bridging this gap between the human and the divine, he re- established the connection, and set things in order once more and made it possible for the human race to receive influx from a higher level.
Christ was therefore two things and his task was to connect these two things and for this reason everything that we read about Christ is paradoxical and requires a form of understanding that is not logical in the ordinary sense. He descended and eventually ascended but his ascent was due to his own efforts; starting from his birth on this earth from his mother he had to overcome this birth and be re-born and for this reason the teaching of the Gospels is full of this idea of re-birth. How often Christ says 'Ye must be re-born' and how difficult it is to understand what this means. But if we catch a glimpse of what we might call the idea of Christ and the whole drama of his death and resurrection, we can then understand better why, in the extra- ordinary parable or incident called the marriage at Cana, when he turns water into wine, he says, to his Mother, 'Woman,
what have I to do with thee?' We can realise that the significance of this incident in the second chapter of John refers to a stage that Jesus had reached in himself and that it signifies that he had overcome the human side of himself and had at least reached some definite step in this inner evolution. He was now in possession of another level of understanding in the long path of his return to the divine level. He has, for the time being, nothing to do with that side of him represented by the mother. And yet he says to his mother, who will finally crucify him, 'Woman, what have I to do with thee? Mine hour is not yet come.' We can understand dimly this means that the human side was not yet overcome and that the final overcoming of it meant death on the cross. His body came from his mother and it too had to be triumphed over, and indeed transformed, so that even after its death it could be used as a living physical body no longer having its sustenance from life but from forces outside life. This typified the complete union of the human with the divine, of the lower with the higher.
But when Jesus reached the stage of being able to turn water into wine, this complete transmutation had not taken place. It was preceded by a psychological transformation represented by the power of turning water into wine, which in the words of John, was his first sign. The miracle followed from the sign. It is not called a miracle but a sign, that is, a sign that Jesus had reached a certain stage of inner power, which he could communicate to representative objects such as water. Water, in the ancient representative language of parables, is truth. The turning of water into wine signifies the turning of truth into something that is not merely truth but a stage beyond truth; when you see the truth of Truth and its values, truth is no longer simply truth but becomes full of meaning. What was formerly truth by faith begins to multiply itself into endless meaning, so that it is no longer merely truth but a continual source of meaning that can intoxicate the soul as wine. A union has taken place between truth and something else. We can call it the meaning of truth or the good that lies in truth and reaches us through the medium of truth as its recipient. So Jesus calls upon the servants, who, if you notice, are commanded by the mother to obey him and to fill the water pots full of water to
the brim, and transforms the water into wine. This means that all the truth that Jesus has acquired can be transformed into its real meaning by him.
In our own experience we sometimes suddenly see the connection between a number of things that have previously been separate and unconnected and then we understand differently, just as when the separate letters of the alphabet which we are learning as children, magically turn into words or even whole sentences and we reach an entirely different level of under- standing.
Now glance at the end of the parable after Jesus has turned water into wine. This wine is taken to the ruler of the feast, who makes a curious remark. He says that ordinarily, that means in life, for the ruler of the feast represents life and its methods, the good wine comes first. 'Every man setteth on first the good wine; and when men have drunk freely, then that which is worse: thou hast kept the good wine until now. This beginning of his signs did Jesus in Cana of Galilee and manifested his glory; and his disciples believed on him.' Notice the word good is used. In some esoteric teaching the words truth and good are used and they speak of a marriage that is possible between truth and good, such that the man sees the good of a truth he has been taught and so begins to be governed by good and not merely by truth. Notice that the good comes last, in as it were an inverse order to life, as the ruler of the feast indicates. In life we tend to take the good first and the worst afterwards. In this connection it might be said that to climb the ladder of self development we must pay beforehand.
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Responses:
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22333 |
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Date: June 12, 2020 at 17:54:42
From: georg, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: but you are limiting your thinking about God |
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why do you think I am leaving out Mary? leaving out the priests is not leaving out anyone in the family
why are you so belligerent all of a sudden?
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Responses:
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Charles : Bible : Religion ] [ Main Menu ] |