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55209 |
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Date: August 24, 2024 at 10:52:58
From: shadow , [DNS_Address]
Subject: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
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Do you know *for a fact* that there exist *no details, on
any level, within circles of global hierarchical power we
know nothing of,* that could possibly incline a United
States President toward choosing to continue arming a
country that commits inhumane atrocities? In the face of
exactly how outrageous and unconscionable that is?
Do you?
In other words...if you agree that you know this, for a
fact, then you're saying it's literally impossible for
there to exist *any reason whatsoever*...including within
the vast realm of The Unknown To Us...for the U.S. to
continue arming Israel...
So are you claiming this, by this very fair definition?
Knowing how unlikely you are to respond...lol...I'll just
go ahead and venture my guess that yes, you'd still say
you have grounds to claim such a thing...
...and if so, you're fulla baloney...end of...
I'm not saying there IS *any good reason* for it -- as
seen through my own and your ideals -- but as seen from a
perspective *that includes all of the Unknowns you
categorically refuse to consider*...yes indeed,
parameters that could make the U.S.'s choice to continue
arming Israel pale in comparison do likely exist...
...and you cannot prove that they don't...
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Responses:
[55221] [55224] [55225] [55234] [55235] [55238] [55244] [55245] [55249] [55251] [55254] [55256] [55263] [55272] [55286] [55287] [55246] [55247] [55248] [55237] [55231] [55233] [55239] |
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55221 |
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Date: August 24, 2024 at 19:17:41
From: mitra, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
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Lots of articles, especially from 2006, showing past
and continued support of Hamas by Russia, China & Iran,
including recent trips by Hamas to Moscow and Iran.
The fingerprints of Russian propaganda are all over the
news about the conflict.
So, I cannot second guess reasons for U.S. support of
Israel, anymore than Russia/China/Iran plans for the
region.
As to why this war is so poorly managed and goes on...
I have no words.
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Responses:
[55224] [55225] [55234] [55235] [55238] [55244] [55245] [55249] [55251] [55254] [55256] [55263] [55272] [55286] [55287] [55246] [55247] [55248] [55237] [55231] [55233] [55239] |
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55224 |
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Date: August 24, 2024 at 21:59:52
From: old timer, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
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are you really holding out hope there might be a reason to justify the
potus supplying the weapons that israel is using to commit genocide?
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Responses:
[55225] [55234] [55235] [55238] [55244] [55245] [55249] [55251] [55254] [55256] [55263] [55272] [55286] [55287] [55246] [55247] [55248] [55237] [55231] [55233] [55239] |
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55225 |
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Date: August 25, 2024 at 00:14:41
From: mitra, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
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Do you really believe Hamas operates alone? That they
visit Moscow and Tehran for the last month and previous
eighteen years for the sights?
There are definitely reasons to support Israel. What
the policy for a venture that costs such time, money,
effort in this way I do not know.
Read the posts. The munitions on order and approved
won't be delivered for years.
Why this is happening in this way I do not understand,
do not approve and consider the method as much a war
crime as killing the buffalo to subjugate the Lakota.
But if you think that it is happening because one
person is crazy in charge, that would be like Hitler
hating Jews. He didn't do it in isolation, he didn't
do it alone, and the land and treasure and life of the
people were absorbed by compliant neighbors and
corporations.
The difference is Hamas is the agent of forces that
want to control Africa and Europe and the Middle East
for their purposes, and consider the Palestine people
as nothing more than bait for your attention.
Netanyahu may be playing both ends against the middle.
It is beyond me why the Palestinians can't be fed
watered and housed while the solution is found.
Oh. Right They can't because Hamas is still
fighting, bombing, shooting. So Hamas wants:
people to starve;
people to be sick;
people to die;
people for hostages
people for Twitter photos.
And you act as if Israel is the only player when Hamas
is keeping the Palestinians hostage as any concert
going Israelis or visitors.
Hamas is on a suicide mission and they don't care who
else dies -- 100,000 civilians is not too many.
Not too many for them, maybe. Clearly not too many for
Russia or Iran who are helping to starve 26 million in
the Sudan.
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Responses:
[55234] [55235] [55238] [55244] [55245] [55249] [55251] [55254] [55256] [55263] [55272] [55286] [55287] [55246] [55247] [55248] [55237] [55231] [55233] [55239] |
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55234 |
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Date: August 25, 2024 at 10:58:12
From: old timer, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
URL: https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/06/26/politics/us-arms-shipments-israel |
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does all that mean yes you are holding out hope there is some reason to
justify potus sending weapons that israel is using to slaughter women and
children in gaza?
and don’t believe bopp’s dishonest shit that these are all future deliveries.
a steady stream of weapons has been flowing to israel while they are
committing genocide, see the cnn article. the flow could be stopped to
convince our ally israel to stop killing women and children
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Responses:
[55235] [55238] [55244] [55245] [55249] [55251] [55254] [55256] [55263] [55272] [55286] [55287] [55246] [55247] [55248] [55237] |
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55235 |
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Date: August 25, 2024 at 11:46:19
From: mitra, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
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"yes you are holding out hope ..." only that *you* will
answer *Shadow's* question.
". the flow could be stopped to
convince our ally israel to stop killing women and
children"
The bombing would stop if Hamas would surrender and
stop shooting and bombing. War is not the answer.
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Responses:
[55238] [55244] [55245] [55249] [55251] [55254] [55256] [55263] [55272] [55286] [55287] [55246] [55247] [55248] [55237] |
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55238 |
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Date: August 25, 2024 at 13:25:26
From: old timer, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
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“The bombing would stop if Hamas would surrender and stop shooting
and bombing. ”
you’ve pushed this idea repeatedly, but that really sounds heartless. do
you really believe israel can continue to bomb hospitals, schools, refugee
camps and kill women and children, doctors , journalists and aid workers
without any responsibility as long as hamas is out there?
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Responses:
[55244] [55245] [55249] [55251] [55254] [55256] [55263] [55272] [55286] [55287] [55246] [55247] [55248] |
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55244 |
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Date: August 25, 2024 at 17:03:38
From: mitra, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
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Without responsibility?
The World Court wants a conversation about war crimes.
Israel is surrounded by governments and millions
wanting their heads. The people of Israel itself are
against the management of this war. They are facing
institutional financial constraints. Hamas keeps
shooting and Israel still doesn't have control of Gaza.
That sounds to me as if they are facing responsibility
now and in the future.
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Responses:
[55245] [55249] [55251] [55254] [55256] [55263] [55272] [55286] [55287] [55246] [55247] [55248] |
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55245 |
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Date: August 25, 2024 at 17:32:11
From: old timer, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
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the problem is the genocide is still happening and it’s time for it to stop.
the us should stop sending them weapons and until they stop pressure
should be brought to stop the slaughter of civilians that israel is still
doing. several in power in israel should face charges for crimes against
humanity and israel may find it difficult to get weapons to defend
themselves because they have shown that can’t be trusted to use them in
accordance with international law. above all it is time to stop the
senseless slaughter
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Responses:
[55249] [55251] [55254] [55256] [55263] [55272] [55286] [55287] [55246] [55247] [55248] |
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55249 |
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Date: August 25, 2024 at 23:55:32
From: mitra, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer ... nukes? |
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Has it occurred to you if Israel were to fall back on
their own resources for munitions the nuclear option
would appear to them more viable?
Biden/US walks a tightrope over that nuclear option,
Egypt, Saudi,Iran, Lebanon and other interests,
alliances and conflicts.
All while pushing for peace and staving off world war
with strength. It would make my head hurt and I'm not
even 78.
Tell Hamas to free their people and let them get food,
water, medical and housing free of Hamas. That is the
safest way to stop this war, which by the way comes of
genocidal intent from both sides, just at the moment
one side has more guns.
My objection to your and a few others is that you do
not recognize the string that whips your emotions is
power held by Hamas, the sound is the screaming in
grief and pain of the people from the snapping of that
whip.
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[55251] [55254] [55256] [55263] [55272] [55286] [55287] |
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55251 |
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Date: August 26, 2024 at 01:46:47
From: old timer, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer ... nukes? |
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“My objection to your and a few others is that you do
not recognize the string that whips your emotions is
power held by Hamas, the sound is the screaming in
grief and pain of the people from the snapping of that
whip.”
that is a harsh and heartless thing to say to people speaking up about the
mass slaughter of civilians, mostly women and children. the number
doctors, journalists and aid workers show that israel is making no effort to
protect innocent people in gaza. the madness has to stop, it’s time to cut
off their weapons. as far as the nuclear option, well that is a good point
and if israel is no more responsible with nuclear than they have been then
it may be time to disarm israel and label them a rogue state
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55254 |
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Date: August 26, 2024 at 06:44:16
From: mitra, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer ... nukes? |
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That mass slaughter is orchestrated by Hamas.
As to heartless, what of "100,000 not too many" shows
heart?
What does telling a starving father of a starving
family that if he takes food from anyone other than
Hamas he will be killed demonstrates "heart"!?!
What does planting hostages with a doctor's family
shows "heart"!?!
Yes. The madness has to stop. So call for all sides
to stop at least. Not just Israel. The focus on
Israel is just one of the many wrong things of this
war.
I don't trust, like or support the way this war is
being run, Netanyahu is a horror.
Cut off Israel's weapons and they will be overrun, let
Russia and Iran have the ME.
As to disarming a nuclear power, good luck with that.
You go first.
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[55256] [55263] [55272] [55286] [55287] |
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55256 |
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Date: August 26, 2024 at 10:58:29
From: old timer, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer ... nukes? |
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“That mass slaughter is orchestrated by Hamas”
that’s blatantly false. hamas orchestrated the oct 7 attacks but the 10
months of slaughtering women and children in gaza has been
orchestrated and carried out by israel with horrific results
i do think israel should consider what happens if they get their weapons
supply cut off and can they survive. that should be something they
consider every time they kill women and children, doctors, journalists and
aid workers. the idea we can’t cut off the weapons supply and have to
support israel’s genocide because of iran or russia is absurd
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[55263] [55272] [55286] [55287] |
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55263 |
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Date: August 26, 2024 at 14:44:37
From: mitra, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer ... nukes? |
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"hamas orchestrated the oct 7 attacks"
Right. And their refusal to surrender keeps the horror
going. The bodies they step over on the way to Moscow
and Tehran are their responsibility.
"we can’t cut off the weapons supply and have to
support israel’s genocide because of iran or russia is
absurd"
Certainly no more absurd than blaming Israel alone and
pretending that a people under attack for 70 years,
losing people constantly to terrorist bombings and
personal random attacks then forced to war with their
neighbors, with the very real threat of genocide and
annihilation and missiles from all sides, are capable
of just shooting this or that target alone without
going crazy. I think they are, as most soldiers in
that situation.
Further add to the mix the right wing hawks who may
benefit and expect to benefit in the future from
shuffling a people around, starving them, shooting
journalists, etc., keeping bare necessities from
innocents, these are war crimes, and the World Court
knows it.
War crimes that would end if Hamas surrendered and the
world aid associations were allowed to do their work.
You have an entire population with PTSD and with all
that a huge percentage do not support Netanyahu or what
he and his buds are doing, so don't tell me it's
"Israel" at fault.
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[55272] [55286] [55287] |
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55272 |
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Date: August 27, 2024 at 12:19:42
From: old timer, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer ... nukes? |
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“And their refusal to surrender keeps the horror going. The bodies they
step over on the way to Moscow and Tehran are their responsibility.”
this is why i keep saying you absolve israel from any blame in the ongoing
genocide in gaza. israel doesn’t get a free pass to continue slaughtering
innocent civilians until hamas surrenders. that is a war crime and a crime
against humanity. israel is doing the killing of all these people and israel is
the only one that can stop doing a thing so horrific that is should be
obvious to all they are wrong
“Certainly no more absurd than blaming Israel alone”
but israel is the one who is committing genocide and crimes against
humanity. blame for this ongoing human tragedy is squarely on them.
hamas is to blame for many deaths, hamas committed a cowardly act of
terrorism that started this most recent violence but nothing, absolutely
nothing justifies israel’s ongoing genocide. 10 months so far israel has
been pounding gaza and killing civilians including those 7 wck aid workers
who were simply trying to feed the starving people of gaza
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Responses:
[55286] [55287] |
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55286 |
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Date: August 27, 2024 at 20:15:47
From: mitra, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer ... nukes? |
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Netanyahu doesn't get a free pass. The World Court,
people in Israel, the world over will punish Israel for
Netanyahu's action.
Israel isn't killing or starving any more than
Palestine killed people at a Concert for Peace.
That's why I won't condemn the people of Israel anymore
than the people of Palestine. In my mind they have
both been and are being played and used.
As to the rest, it has been answered, you choose not to
acknowledge what does not fit into a very narrow
channel that includes blaming a different set of
innocents and I won't do it.
I have known Israelis and Palestinians and know them to
be as free of their leaders' decisions as I was when
Nixon bombed Cambodia.
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Responses:
[55287] |
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55287 |
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Date: August 27, 2024 at 22:18:59
From: old timer, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer ... nukes? |
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no one is trying to condemn the people of israel, but since the government
of israel is still slaughtering civilians every day and they should be
condemned for this ongoing action. they are committing war crimes and
crimes against humanity and yes they will pay for it. they have ensured
generations of terrorism against themselves. the world’s view of israel has
dropped and they find themselves increasingly isolated
but do you know what israel will do tomorrow? sure you do, they will kill
some more civilians, mostly women and children in gaza. same for the day
after that and the day after that. personally i don’t see any possible way
for israel to come out of this mess and the longer they keep committing
crimes against humanity the worse they will end up
the killing needs to stop
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Responses:
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55246 |
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Date: August 25, 2024 at 18:04:50
From: ryan, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
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well you better hold your nose and vote for kamala than...there is a much better chance she will stop sending them weapons then there is the rump will...
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Responses:
[55247] [55248] |
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55247 |
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Date: August 25, 2024 at 19:27:36
From: old timer, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
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trump is definitely not going to stop the flow of weapons. this is an issue
where i tend to agree with most liberals, but oddly the dnc and you
political party over ideology people seem more in line with the right wing
position. crazy world eh?
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[55248] |
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55248 |
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Date: August 25, 2024 at 21:33:46
From: ryan, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
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Responses:
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55237 |
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Date: August 25, 2024 at 12:49:48
From: old timer, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
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rarely read shadow’s posts and this absurd question is why. she is asking
if the president of the united states could possibly have a reason to
continue sending weapons to israel while they are using us provided
weapons to slaughter women and children. that’s why i asked if anyone
was really holding out hope of some reason to justify the potus supplying
weapons that israel is using to commit genocide.
maybe a better question is what possible reason could there be to
justify the potus supplying weapons that israel is using to commit
genocide? and i can’t imagine any valid answer which would have to sound
holocaust deniers coming up with excuses to justify what the nazis did
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55231 |
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Date: August 25, 2024 at 07:08:10
From: chaskuchar@stcharlesmo, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
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i believe that hamas is Palestinian, not an agent of
iran. iran is supporting hamas because she is wary of
israel. they were both from the same father and the
bible is true that they would fight each other.
Hezbollah is acting on Palestine because so many of them
are Palestinian. the answer will come when the world war
is over. probably after my lifetime.
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[55233] [55239] |
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55233 |
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Date: August 25, 2024 at 08:51:50
From: mitra, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
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Tangent, but okay...
After the world war I believe, religion will be banned
entirely because it has been used as the reason for
war. Too dangerous for the new rulers. This war isn't
going on because the principals consider each other
brothers, but because they both claim the same God gave
the land to them exclusively, one before being kicked
out 2000 years ago and the other by winning by
conquest.
These myths supercede that they are brothers,
genetically ( when did Semitic become Jewish? ) that
the Palestinian was not in control of that land for
hundreds of years, others, most recently Turks were,
and Israel hadn't been in control since the Romans
dispersed them.
The State of Israel was designed to destroy the
Israelis if you look at the map. When they *surprise*
won every war against them the myth that God gave the
land to Muslims should have been heads up maybe God
changed their/his mind and gave it back. Didn't work
that way.
From the myths as they are playing out God is a beast
that sets his children on each other to watch the show
and drink the blood and wallow in the misery. They need
another God or a better understanding of who/what God
is.
If you want to continue we should do this on another
board.
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55239 |
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Date: August 25, 2024 at 14:26:33
From: chaskuchar@stcharlesmo, [DNS_Address]
Subject: Re: Question for akira and old timer (and anyone else) |
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c-bib-rel would be the board
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Responses:
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